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Ultimate Rollercoaster > Discussion Forums > Roller Coasters, Parks & Attractions > Holiday World Turmoil

Holiday World Turmoil

CarolH

Posted:
1/9/13 at
9:31:07 PM

I found this very interesting.

Control of Holiday World at stake in legal battle

Re: Holiday World Turmoil by RobLec RobLec Profile at 1/9/13 10:08:23 PM
Interesting, yes, but very long and detailed "legaleze". If I understand correctly, she basically wants more money for her share of the park. As I recall, in the past she has never really wanted to have anything to do with the place.

Thank you Carol. It will be interesting to see how this plays out. Will we be seeing you at HWN?

Re: Holiday World Turmoil by chitlins73 chitlins73 Profile at 1/9/13 10:10:43 PM
What a mess!!!
Re: Holiday World Turmoil by CoasterFanatic CoasterFanatic Profile at 1/9/13 11:50:18 PM
Which has to be hard on the entire family/buisness in general. They had offers several years back and Im glad it wasn't sold to Morgan or Six Flags. But like Kennywood. Too many hands in the kitty causes problems.

I have no idea where things stand other than what was stated and have no real thoughts on it other than I hope the park survives and all do well in the end.

Chuck, who's statement on Kennywood was the formers owners statement that several families were involved in the ownership and it was getting difficult to keep everyone happy. So they sold and paid everyone off and were out.

Charles Nungester 323 coasters and holding for two years now LOL Last coaster ride. HWN 2011
Re: Holiday World Turmoil by Eric_Gieszl Eric_Gieszl Profile at 1/9/13 11:51:51 PM
Typical of so many family businesses. It's either estate taxes owed or ownership battles like this that result in so many "family businesses" falling into the hands of big corporations after the death of an owner-operator.
--
Eric
Ultimate Rollercoaster Moderator
Re: Holiday World Turmoil by Overbanked Overbanked Profile at 1/10/13 3:59:56 AM
Holiday World announced their new president & CEO Matt Eckert.

www.newsplusnotes.blogspot.com/2013/01/holiday-world-names-new-park-president.html

Re: Holiday World Turmoil by drachen drachen Profile at 1/10/13 9:52:48 AM
It seems that Lori has claimed (and won) that Koch Development didn't buy her out appropriately after Will's death - which means she wanted more money and got it.

But not only did she get it, she got control of the park, ensuring that her children get it when they are ready, as she said "Regardless of the outcome, the park will continue to be owned and operated by members of the Koch family." Dan is out.

Dan, of course, is appealing/countersuing. It seems, without knowing all of the details, that the company was evenly split between Dan, Will, and Natalie. Dan and Will apparently bought Natalie out, in some sort of agreement that left Will as majority owner.

So, the question is: Which side has the best interest of the park in mind? Is Dan the "outsider" as he once left Santa Claus for Florida to do his own thing, having to return when Will died?

Or is Lori the in-law "outsider" that is trying to take the park from what remains of the original Koch family?

Interesting. Poor Pat...

Either way, Eric is right. This is how small, traditional family business die, and get taken over by a corporation.

I hope that doesn't happen here, but if a large company comes in and says they'll pay both sides their money (and then some), both sides may just take the deal.

Cedar Fair's Holiday World? Six Flags Holiday World? Palace Entertainment's Holiday World? I shudder at the thought...

drachen
Coaster to Park Ratio: 4.87 / Steel to Wooden Ratio: 2.57 / Wooden Coaster Percentage: 28%
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Re: Holiday World Turmoil by RobLec RobLec Profile at 1/10/13 11:06:06 AM
drachen said:

So, the question is: Which side has the best interest of the park in mind? Is Dan the "outsider" as he once left Santa Claus for Florida to do his own thing, having to return when Will died?

Or is Lori the in-law "outsider" that is trying to take the park from what remains of the original Koch family?

Interesting. Poor Pat...

Cedar Fair's Holiday World? Six Flags Holiday World? Palace Entertainment's Holiday World? I shudder at the thought...

I'm hoping that if it happens, it might be the Herschend Family Holiday World.

My take on the blood feud is that Dan, as a lawyer, is basically just an administrator at heart, who stepped in to keep things running following his brother's untimely passing. He was just running a business of which he happened to be part owner, but never really wanted to own a theme park.

Will's widow IMO probably saw HW as "the other woman" that likely consumed too much of her late husband's time, and now that he's gone is primarily interested in preserving the park for Will's children... if they may ever be interested.

Sad part is there is probably no one who will care for the place the way Pat has and Will did.

* This post was modified at 1/10/13 11:24:43 AM *

Re: Holiday World Turmoil by drachen drachen Profile at 1/10/13 1:00:56 PM
RobLec said:

I'm hoping that if it happens, it might be the Herschend Family Holiday World.

My take on the blood feud is that Dan, as a lawyer, is basically just an administrator at heart, who stepped in to keep things running following his brother's untimely passing. He was just running a business of which he happened to be part owner, but never really wanted to own a theme park.

Will's widow IMO probably saw HW as "the other woman" that likely consumed too much of her late husband's time, and now that he's gone is primarily interested in preserving the park for Will's children... if they may ever be interested.

Sad part is there is probably no one who will care for the place the way Pat has and Will did.

Yeah. Dan always seemed to be putting on a "happy face". There is something about him that says "I'm really not into this...".

But then that begs the question: Why is he countersuing? Is he protecting the park's interest? Or is he protecting his financial interests?

And what is Lori's intent? Is she protecting the park's interest? Or is she trying to get more money out of the Koch family? Right now, she has the park. Will she now sell, or does she truly plan to keep it "in the family" (Will's)?

I actually have a lot of questions...

How does Kentucky Kingdom/Bluegrass Boardwalk fit into all of this? It had to play a roll, right?

What was Lori's roll in KDC before the December ruling?

If Dan and Will bought Natalie out, what is her roll now with KDC? Was she not to be the CEO of Bluegrass Boardwalk?

Does Dan have kids that he's looking out for?

* This post was modified at 1/10/13 1:07:53 PM *

drachen
Coaster to Park Ratio: 4.87 / Steel to Wooden Ratio: 2.57 / Wooden Coaster Percentage: 28%
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Re: Holiday World Turmoil by frontrow frontrow Profile at 1/10/13 7:22:48 PM
What a mess. How do they plan to continue to market Holiday World as a family park, when their own family is a mess. Some people, including myself, may look at this as an act of corporate greed. They are fighting over millions of dollars and control and power of a multimillion dollar corporation. Sounds like corporate greed to me. As an enthusiast, I'm going to visit Holiday World regardless. I do think this will be upsetting to some of the local residents. I work with a lot of people from that area. The people I work with, are not coaster enthusiasts, but they are very proud of Holiday World. They are proud how a small family park has become a world class destination, right in their back yard. Any time I mention Holiday World to these coworkers, they are well informed about the park's history, management, and future plans. I guess the local news really keeps these people informed. I'm curious what their reaction is now. This was the last step in transforming Holiday World from a local family business to a large corporation.
Re: Holiday World Turmoil by drachen drachen Profile at 1/10/13 7:51:33 PM
frontrow said:

What a mess. How do they plan to continue to market Holiday World as a family park, when their own family is a mess. Some people, including myself, may look at this as an act of corporate greed. They are fighting over millions of dollars and control and power of a multimillion dollar corporation. Sounds like corporate greed to me...

This was the last step in transforming Holiday World from a local family business to a large corporation.

I agree with you, Ken. There is nothing "family" and down to earth about millionaires fighting over millions of dollars.

How does it happen? Well, this all started with either the Koch family short-changing the late Will's wife, or with Will's wife feeling she got short-changed. Either way, it seems as if it was Lori who started the litigation process.

What's missing from the news article is, if Lori simply wanted to be made whole on what she feels she was short-changed, why was she awarded control of KDC and therefore Holiday World? That's not what the 2002 agreement between the siblings stated.

drachen
Coaster to Park Ratio: 4.87 / Steel to Wooden Ratio: 2.57 / Wooden Coaster Percentage: 28%
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Re: Holiday World Turmoil by Eric_Gieszl Eric_Gieszl Profile at 1/10/13 8:13:27 PM
frontrow said:

Sounds like corporate greed to me.

Wait a second.

This is not a family problem per say (based on the type you're implying), nor does it having anything to do with corporate greed, which by the way means what? Does it mean that in the United States it's now a crime for company to make money and be successful. I hate that term "corporate greed". It's a meaningless, nonsense term fueled by our current President who wants to pit people of different classes against each other.

The fact is most corporations are publicly held companies and their success benefits the shareholders and you can be one if you choose to buy their stock. Publicly traded corporations are thus owned by the public (shareholders) and the success benefits those who own shares in the company.

This issue with Holiday World ownership instead is with regards to complicated agreements and fulfillment of those agreements as a result of an untimely death of an owner. The transfer of business ownership from one individual to another is never a simple task. In some scenarios, no matter what sort of agreement, it's impossible to accomplish because it requires a great sum of cash or liquidity which individuals often don't have.

Based on the stories I've read it appears that there are three issues. One, a disagreement over the valuation method to determine what the company is worth and thus what the individual shares are valued at. Two, a shortage of cash or ability to borrow to execute the transaction. Three, a disagreement on whether an existing liability should be credited against the monies owned towards the buyout of Will's shares.

* This post was modified at 1/10/13 8:20:22 PM *

--
Eric
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Re: Holiday World Turmoil by Eric_Gieszl Eric_Gieszl Profile at 1/10/13 8:19:34 PM
drachen said:

There is nothing "family" and down to earth about millionaires fighting over millions of dollars.

That's not fair to say that a millionaire shouldn't care about money or receiving thei